[jocky85]

Good point Munki, I remember watching a kids cable channel the next morning which displayed the banner showing 'please turn to news channel for an announcement from Buckingham Palace'

I was in bed last night too, I had read about Farrah Fawcett on Twitter but nothing had appeared about Michael Jackson at that time. My sister decided to wake me up just after midnight to tell me

[Johnny 1989]

You should see my cousin's Queen tribute band with that dude who won Stars in Their Eyes as Freddie Mercury, they're great. The guy's voice is very much like good ol' Freddie's.

I remember him, the best winner of Stars In Their Eyes in my opinion & not because he was Freddie, he was just superb.

[Zoot]

I don't remember where I was when freddie died, but I remember my radio alarm coming on the morning after Princess Di died because all they played was pan pipe music and I instantly knew something was up. Weirdly I also have a memory of sitting by the fireplace watching the news about john Lennon trying to console my mother but seeing as I would of been just over 1 years old it can't be a real memory.

Last night I was playing WoW and news of jacko going to hospital came over the in game chat.

[Johnny 1989]

I don't remember where I was when freddie died, but I remember my radio alarm coming on the morning after Princess Di died because all they played was pan pipe music and I instantly knew something was up. Weirdly I also have a memory of sitting by the fireplace watching the news about john Lennon trying to console my mother but seeing as I would of been just over 1 years old it can't be a real memory.

Last night I was playing WoW and news of jacko going to hospital came over the in game chat.

That's how I found out, I woke up & switched on Capital FM & they were playing operatic music, my Mum told me what had happened.

BTW I have had six "jokes" about Jackson's death, have to say I haven't laughed at any of them, the man hadn't been dead 24 hours & I have four jokes in 15 minutes.

[Munki Bhoy]

I don't have a problem with the jokes. Some folk don't care and that's their choice. Others deal with grief through humour. I know I've certainly went for humour about things in the past.

Well, I do have a problem with some of the jokes, but then that's a different issue entirely and nothing to do with his death.

[Johnny 1989]

I don't have a problem with the jokes. Some folk don't care and that's their choice. Others deal with grief through humour. I know I've certainly went for humour about things in the past.

Well, I do have a problem with some of the jokes, but then that's a different issue entirely and nothing to do with his death.

To be honest it was more the content than anything else, I mean if, say, Robert Mugabe suddenly pegged it then I wouldn't have a problem. It's just the content of some of them were very tasteless & not funny at all.

[foot-loose]

I get that Michael Jackson made a massive contribution to modern music culture and was a huge influence on so many different artists. I get that people loved him as an artist and an entertainer. I agree that it is sad when anyone dies, especially when there are children involved.

I don't, however, understand this emotional connection with a celebrity that the vast majority of people have never met. Everything that people think they know about him is based on what is told to them by the media, either by his media camp or by someone elses. Surely that means that the Michael Jackson that people "love" is more of a fictional character than a real person? I've been told there was a guy at work in tears over the news. I don't understant that.

I also don't understand why, as I type this, I am expecting that some people might be pissed with my take on it. If so - that's not my purpose.

[Ed Pummelon]

I don't, however, understand this emotional connection with a celebrity that the vast majority of people have never met. Everything that people think they know about him is based on what is told to them by the media, either by his media camp or by someone elses. Surely that means that the Michael Jackson that people "love" is more of a fictional character than a real person? I've been told there was a guy at work in tears over the news. I don't understant that.

That's the part I don't get either. I'm unaffected by this particular death as I didn't like the man or his music, but there are artists and celebrities who do mean an awful lot to me, I love their work, respect what they do and say and so on. But when they suddenly die (as did Steven Wells on the same day as MJ, a writer whose impact on me I don't know how to articulate) it is a shock and a shame but that's it - which is why I simply don't get some of the stuff I've been reading in the last 24 hours (I don't mean on here). Somebody wrote on Twitter yesterday "The music has died" - come on, the guy hadn't released an album in eight years??

I feel like I'm treading on eggshells over this, as I know that many people on here feel very differently, and I'm not trying to offend anybody. I guess I respect the sentiment, I just don't share it.

[Johnny 1989]

I understand where Foots & Ed are coming from, I imagine when I was upset with the death of Freddie Mercury it was because I was young at the time so it was probably a normal reaction (even today kids will cry when, say, their favourite character in a TV show "dies", Freddie was my favourite performer & I supposed back then it was just very sad for me.

Jackson's death is sad, but I didn't cry at all, I feel sorry for him as his last few years have been a trouble period for him & I feel sorry for his kids as they've lost their father but I didn't know him so wouldn't show the same amount of grief to him as I would have done had a family member or friend had died.

I still find it odd hearing the words "Michael Jackson is dead" though as it's something I didn't really expect to hear for many years to come.

[MK Chris]

Weirdly I also have a memory of sitting by the fireplace watching the news about john Lennon trying to console my mother but seeing as I would of been just over 1 years old it can't be a real memory.

While it would have been difficult to console your mum when you were just one, the human mind is an amazing thing, you never know... the memory may not be wholly accurate, but I reckon it could have been based on something that happened. My earliest (and most treasured) memories are from when I was slightly older than that, but I was only three. I have memories of sitting on my Granny's knee and playing with her glasses while my mum went shopping. I also have memories of pushing her round Milton Keynes shopping centre in a wheelchair and mum telling her off because she was trying to do it herself and I wanted to push it. I know these memories are real because my mum confirmed it and was very surprised I remembered - and I know I was not older than three because that's when she died.

[Yudster]

I don't, however, understand this emotional connection with a celebrity that the vast majority of people have never met. Everything that people think they know about him is based on what is told to them by the media, either by his media camp or by someone elses. Surely that means that the Michael Jackson that people "love" is more of a fictional character than a real person? I've been told there was a guy at work in tears over the news. I don't understant that.

That's the part I don't get either. I'm unaffected by this particular death as I didn't like the man or his music, but there are artists and celebrities who do mean an awful lot to me, I love their work, respect what they do and say and so on. But when they suddenly die (as did Steven Wells on the same day as MJ, a writer whose impact on me I don't know how to articulate) it is a shock and a shame but that's it - which is why I simply don't get some of the stuff I've been reading in the last 24 hours (I don't mean on here). Somebody wrote on Twitter yesterday "The music has died" - come on, the guy hadn't released an album in eight years??

I feel like I'm treading on eggshells over this, as I know that many people on here feel very differently, and I'm not trying to offend anybody. I guess I respect the sentiment, I just don't share it.

See I don't understand it either. I agree with everything you have both said. But I can't argue with what I am experiencing either. I know I'm overreacting, i know I'm being irrational - I never thought I had anything remotely approaching an "emotional attachement" to Michael Jackson - but apparently i did. No idea how that happened. Anyway, it'll go away soon enough.

[Boboff]

It's better to have loved and lost, than never to have loved at all.

[Yudster]

Well if you put it like that - i sincerely hope it goes away sooner rather than later!

[Lactating Man Nips]

For me, although I liked everything he did up to and including Thriller, it's not really about Michael Jackson per se. The 'emotional connection' I guess I make is with the passing of a time when the world seemed great, the 80's. His album releases and videos dominated that decade and each billed as real events, which now I can still correlate with the fun and good times I was having.

I suppose his music just reminds me of a kinder and less cycnical world. Whether it really was or wasn't I couldn't tell at the time because it was pre-internet and we only had four channels of TV. There was no rolling news filled with celebrity pap and the music scene wasn't filled with disenfranchised and confused misanthropes making life seem futile - I remember life being way more simple and joyful and I refuse to listen to revisionists that say differently. I guess this particular event just reminds of the feelings I'd like to recapture.

I understand that this wouldn't tally at all with people who actually liked his later stuff during which I admittedly regarded him as an "oh what's he done now? " lost soul.

[Yudster]

................... his later stuff during which I admittedly regarded him as an "oh what's he done now? " lost soul.

Now for me I think that's what I find so sad. Because i remember the glory days before whatever it was that consumed him manifested itself physically, I can't help feeling that so much was wasted years ago and now there can't be any closure with all that. He never talked about why he felt compelled to alter his appearance to the point of disfigurement, he never talked about why he felt the need to appear as a white man ultimately, and from what I read he never talked about it privately either. So I can't help thinking it was all unresolved - I hate the thought that he might never have managed to be at peace with himself in his later life, and now its too late.

Of course the ridiculous thing is that i am spending all this emotional energy on someone I never even knew. I can think of a few possible reasons why I'm doing it, i don't really like any of them though!

[TIAL]

he never talked about why he felt the need to appear as a white man ultimately, and from what I read he never talked about it privately either.

Didn't he say that he had Vitiligo? He may have bleached his skin so the patches of white skin didn't show up.

[Yudster]

He did say that at first but it certainly wasn't a story he stuck to for very long. Anyone could see it wasn't true, and for those of us who do have vitiligo it ws never a credible assertion.

[TIAL]

I wasn't aware he stopped talking about it. There's a few quotes from him on here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufqMSTYQy3g

If that's not true then I really can't fathom why he'd want to change his skin colour. I guess, as you say, we'll never know the truth.

[MK Chris]

I thought it was commonly accepted that he was diagnosed with that, although I fully admit I've never looked into it properly and I know next to nothing about the disease.

[Latina]

I thought it was commonly accepted that he was diagnosed with that, although I fully admit I've never looked into it properly and I know next to nothing about the disease.

That's what I thought too. It was vitiligo that set him off at least, but I heard he also used a lot of pale make-up to even out the tone.

[Latina]

Damn, can't edit. Also meant to post the wiki link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitiligo

[Yudster]

Thing is, vitiligo initially presents - and mostly only presents - with small patches of pigment loss. As in this case it would have been considerably easier for a black man to have evened this out by using dark make up on the patches rather than bleaching his whole body, i find the whole thing daft. I have suffered from vitiligo for many many years. The affected area has grown, but it is certainly a tiny area compared to the unaffected parts. I simply don't believe it - and as far as I am aware it was never really given any credence then or since. Certainly I have heard interviews with at least one of his brothers where its mentioned as a distressing psychological compulsion rather than a medical one.

[Lactating Man Nips]

I always thought it was just another step of his total body morphing transformation he was inflicting on himself as part of a greater fantasy.

He certainly never spent as much effort explaining the other plastic surgery as much as the whitening. It's as if when a black man changes his facial features towards a caucasian 'look' then that's fairly well accepted by society, whereas whitening the skin is crossing some line of understanding that needs to be explained. No wonder he wanted to be left alone.

Most of his later videos were filmed actually highlighting his dayglo porcelain look, which I'm sure was at his request, so he certainly wasn't trying to play it down. Anyway, I'm sure if he wanted to, he could have 'browned' the whitened skin to blend in rather than the opposite.

[Zoot]

Thing is, vitiligo initially presents - and mostly only presents - with small patches of pigment loss. As in this case it would have been considerably easier for a black man to have evened this out by using dark make up on the patches rather than bleaching his whole body, i find the whole thing daft. I have suffered from vitiligo for many many years. The affected area has grown, but it is certainly a tiny area compared to the unaffected parts. I simply don't believe it - and as far as I am aware it was never really given any credence then or since. Certainly I have heard interviews with at least one of his brothers where its mentioned as a distressing psychological compulsion rather than a medical one.

So is vitiligo very noticeable on white skin?
The rumour was that he changed his appearance because he wanted to look as different to his father as possible.
One thing is really bothering me at the moment - We've all know for a while that he was 'troubled'. He's mutilated himself literally beyond recognition. He's bankcrupted himself due to an obvious spending addiction so we know he's 'allegedly' had control over his money, yet it's been widely reported that he's a 'repressed 10 year old'. Newspaper reports are stating that he was a little over 8 stone when he died and riddled with pin holes. He had nothing in his stomach apart from half dissolved pills. It's obvious to us now that he was in no fit state to perform gigs, yet he was due to do 50 sell out performances starting in a couple of weeks. He must of had a 'team' working with him, I mean we know he had a personal doctor, and there must of been management, staff etc buzzing around at all times for years. So...
Why the * didn't someone do something???? Didn't anyone stop and think 'Oh hang on, This isn't quite right, lets stop a minute'? No, and you know why I think? because they were all 'Yes men' who had a cash cow. He was in so much debt that they forced him do commit to a huge amount of gigs of which he was obviously in no state to do, but he agreed to do them. He was on a huge amount of prescription drugs. I bet you could have chopped his leg off and he wouldn't of noticed.

I would not be suprised that in the up coming months news emerges that there's a huge discrepancy in his accounts.



I'll tell you why I think -

[Zoot]

I'll tell you why I think -

ignore that last line...